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  Sheilar from China versus Kim from Denmark
 

 

 
By coincidence Kim from Denmark met Sheilar from China on the e-mail – and immediately there were LCs in the air.

Read the intense and open minded discussion on a number of LC issues:

  • Topic1; UCP 600 article 20:
    On board notations on Bills of lading according to UCP 600
  • Topic2; ISBP para 158:
    Original railway bills
  • Topic3; UCP 600 article 20(a)(v):
     Terms an conditions of carriage
  • Topic4; Freight forwarders and NVOCC’s
  • Topic5; Changes in International standard banking practice
  • Topic6; Sheilars background

 

 
 
Sheilar from China:
 
  Dear Kim,

Recently I have read many articles from the prestigious LC Views website, most of which, especially yours are quite helpful and valuable for my work in a bank. Frankly speaking, it’s amazing to read your words about LC.

As for UCP 600 and ISBP 681, there is something really uncertain for me, about which

Maybe you can give me some explanation.

 

Topic1:
UCP 600
article 20

Go to next post in Topic1

Q No.1:

According to UCP 500 Art. 23, if the bill of lading indicates a place of receipt different from the port of loading, the on board notation must also include the port of loading stipulated in the Credits and the name of the vessel on which the goods have been Loaded. However, these wordings have disappeared in UCP 600 Art. 20. Does it imply that under UCP 600, on board notation without indication of port of loading or the name of vessel is O.K. even if the place of receipt is different from the port of loading?

 

Topic2:
ISBP para 158

Go to next post in Topic2

 

Q No.2:

The first sentence in ISBP 681 paragraph 158 shows that only rail and inland Waterway transport document will be accepted as original whether or not it is marked as original. Compared with ISBP 645, this used to apply to three transport documents including road transport document. Is it a change or merely a mistake in typing?

 

Topic3:
UCP 600
article 20(a)(v)

Go to next post in Topic3

 

Q No.3:

With reference to UCP 600 Art. 20(a)(v), contents of terms and conditions of carriage will not be examined. However, if some terms indicated on the surface of bill of lading like “Goods will only be delivered against issuing bank’s guarantee” has unfavorably affected the function of bill of lading, should the bank still disregard this?

 
Best regards

Sheilar from China

 

Kim from Denmark:

 

  Dear Sheilar,

Thanks for your e-mail and your kind words.

I can see that you surely know how to point out the soft spots :-) So let me try to provide my view of things (without any responsibility or liability):

 

Topic1:
UCP 600
article 20

 

Q No.1

My view is that this rule has been removed - and therefore does not apply anymore.

If you look at ISBP (2003) you will see that paragraph 82 (Hong Kong CY versus Hong Kong) has not been carried forward to ISBP (2007) - since this was linked to UCP 500, article 23(a)(ii) - paragraph 5 to me this underline the view that the rules does not apply anymore.

So as far as I am concerned the on board notation should comply with UCP 600 article 20(a)(ii).

I guess the tricky part is that there have been quite many views - and much discussion on this one - so it is still open how the "practical interpretation" of this will be. We will only find that out when e.g. someone puts a query on this one to the ICC.

 

Topic2:
ISBP para 158

 

Q No.2

Again: good question.

I think that the ISBP words you quote (based on UCP 600, article 24(b)(ii) and (iii)) are inserted to underline that it is industry practice to issue them this way. As far as I can tell this is superfluous as the originality is based on article 17 - which does not require that all originals are marked originals – but merely gives this as one way on making the a document “original”.

So my personal view is that any transport document must be originals according to article 17.

 

Topic3:
UCP 600
article 20(a)(v)

Go to next post in Topic3

 

Q No.3

Good one :-)

The purpose of the article that you quote is that banks are not to read all the small print on the transport document.

If there is a clear and visible clause that indicates that the bill of lading presented is not enough to obtain release of the goods - my view would be that such is not acceptable.

Also please note ISBP (2007) paragraph 114.

 

  I hope this helps you. Should you have comments or further questions, please do not hesitate to contact me.

Best regards

Kim

 

Sheilar from China:
 
 
Dear Kim,

What a surprise to receive your reply so soon!

I'm so lucky and so grateful for your help. Your point of view really gives me better understanding of stipulations under UCP 600.

This weekend I have been invited to give lecture training for our customers about UCP 600, who are exporters in the industry of CD and CDR. I guess there will more query on this issue. If there is something valuable and interesting, maybe I will contact you again.

Thank you for what you have done to me.

Best regards

Sheilar from China

 

Sheilar from China:
 
  Dear Kim,

Your brilliant opinion on UCP 600 helped me in my lecture training for our customers last Saturday. They have many queries on transportation documents, especially on forwarder’s bill of lading.

 

Topic4:
FBL
NVOCC

Go to next post in Topic4

 

As you know, some credits bear clause like “Forwarder bill of lading acceptable”.

As there is nothing specific in UCP and ISBP to describe the characteristics of such documents, the concept of “freight forwarder” is quite confusing. How can we know that a bill of lading is issued by a forwarder? Is it judged merely by the issuer’s name (e.g. “xxx agency” or “xx logistic”) or something else? Although ICC Publication no.632 R225 refers to such bill of lading, the relative analysis of ICC however puts focus on the circumstances

how forwarder’s bill of lading should be signed without mentioning the features of the

issuer – in this case the forwarder.

 

Topic3:
UCP 600
article 20(a)(v)

Go to next post in Topic3

As for your personal view of my previous Q No.3, I really agree with you. That’s for sure that banks usually refuse bills of lading with clause like “Goods will be delivered against issuing bank’s guarantee.” However, it’s difficult to search for reason for such refusal in both UCP and ISBP, isn’t it? Does it reflect that some banking practice goes beyond the stipulations of UCP 600 and ISBP (2007)?

 

  Best regards

Sheilar from China

 

Kim from Denmark:

 

 

Dear Sheilar,

 

Topic4:
FBL
NVOCC

Go to next post in Topic4

 

As you may know – the issue of the freight forwarders is of high interest to me. There are documented practices regarding the freight forwarder. Let me try to illustrate this to you:
 

Scenario 1:

The L/C is silent as to freight forwarders

UCP 600 article 14(l):
A transport document may be issued by any party other than a carrier, owner, master or charterer provided that the transport document meets the requirements of articles 19, 20, 21, 22, 23 or 24 of these rules.

 

Scenario 2:

LC text: Transport document issued by a Freight Forwarder is acceptable

ISBP (2007) paragraphs 72 (MMTD), 95 (B/L), 138 (AWB)
72. If a credit states "Freight Forwarder's Multimodal transport document is acceptable" or uses a similar phrase, then the multimodal transport document may be signed by a freight forwarder in the capacity of a freight forwarder, without the need to identify itself as carrier or agent for the named carrier. In this event, it is not necessary to show the name of the carrier.

 

Scenario 3:

LC text: Transport document issued by a Freight Forwarder is not acceptable

ICC opinion TA.572
The terminology “Transport document issued by Freight Forwarder not acceptable” is an ambiguous term … the bank would be obliged to accept a bill of lading that was signed “as carrier” irrespective of any knowledge they may have as to the capacity of the issuer.

 

Variation a:

LC text: Master Air Waybill consigned to …

ICC opinion TA.621
UCP 500 Article 27 is silent on the effect of a HAWB No. or a MAWB No. As long as an Air Waybill issued by a freight forwarder fulfils the requirements of UCP 500 sub-Article 27(a)(i) in conjunction with UCP 500 Article 30, and thereby clearly shows that it is a carrier-type document, there is no ground for rejecting such transport document solely for the reason that it shows a HAWB No. or a MAWB No.

 

Variation b:

LC text: Transport document issued by a Freight Forwarder is not acceptable even if signed as carrier or agent for the carrier

No ICC practice exist !
This clause is a reaction to TA.572 – and is an attempt to underline that documents that appear to be issued by freight forwarders are really not acceptable. E.g.:

  • FIATA documents
  • FBL / HAWB
  • Companies with ”forwarder” or similar in their name

 

The above is taken from my new power point slides on freight forwarders. They are part of a seminar I am holding in September for exporters and transport companies regarding transport documents versus documentary credits. You are the first to see this - and it might be subject to changes - but I expect that the core conclusions will help you.

In any case ICC opinions TA.572 and TA.621 is important in the understanding of how the LC bankers perceive the freight forwarder.

I would also like to refer to two articles on this issue:

  • DCInsight Vol. 11 No.3 July - September 2005: End the fuss about transport documents issued by forwarders
    A
    lthough acknowledging the current practice – I suggest a new one – as far as I can see much more in line with industry practice – and common sense for that matter.
     
  • DC World Volume 11, Number 7 (July/August 2007): The logic of UCP logic
    Where I discuss TA.621 – and analyze the ways to argue in this specific matter.

 

Topic3:
UCP 600
article 20(a)(v)
As for Q No.3; the concept of "International Standard Banking Practice" is rather wide - and may actually change over time; so indeed there are "practices" not directly mentioned in ISBP or UCP; it may be in ICC Opinions, DOCDEX decisions, ICC Decisions or for that matter Positions Papers (however only applicable to UCP 500).

So what I did in answering your questions - I searched for identical scenarios in the existing ICC publications. I was not able to find those - but did then rely on ISBP (2007) paragraph 114 - and applied the same principle. On this one you may in fact argue both ways - and if you are in a dispute you may present a query to the ICC - in order to establish precise on that exact issue.

 

 
If you have questions to any of this, just let me know.

Best regards

Kim

 

Sheilar from China:
 
  Dear Kim,

Thanks very much for your kind and generous help. For me, it's not so easy to obtain material of ICC opinion. But you have offered me so much.

I am so sorry to have bothered you when you were busy with your work yesterday. I can feel your enthusiasm for this field of LC.

 

Topic4:
FBL
NVOCC

Go to next post in Topic4

 

As one of your sincere readers, I also feel especially proud that I'm your first reader of the slides and your new article on freight forwarders. They are great.

I like the slides very much, which display what you want to say more easily to understand. As far as I concerned the reason why ICC emphasizes the capacity in relation to a transport document with "freight forwarder" is that this is a easily operational way for bankers to examine documents, compared with the effort to identify the nature of the issuer( e.g. to tell whether or not they are issued by forwarder.) isn't it?

I'm reading your new article the Logic of UCP Logic. I do have some idea about that. But please give me more time to read it carefully. Once I have a clear idea about it, I will let you know.

 

  Best regards

Sheilar from China

 

Kim from Denmark:

 

  Hi Sheilar,

Thanks - glad you liked it. Any comments are highly appreciated.

 

Topic4:
FBL
NVOCC

Go to next post in Topic4

I would like to offer one comment on the background for the ICC "perception" of the freight forwarder. My personal view is that the reason for this is based in history. In the beginning the "freight forwarder" was an "intermediary" between e.g. shipper and the shipping line - so they would always have some kind of "agent" role.

As time has progressed this has changed - so that the freight forwarder offers services in their own name - assuming the full responsibility (e.g. “as carrier”). So what I am trying with my articles is to make the banking community understand this - so that they will change the perception of the freight forwarder - and thereby change "practice".

The big challenge is - that there may be huge regional differences between freight forwarders. In the Nordic countries the freight forwarder is highly regulated - and there is mandatory liability insurance. In the Middle East however it is not regulated at all - and everyone can call themselves a freight forwarder - which of course makes it more risky - and which is the reason for the reluctance towards the freight forwarder in that part of the world.

 

  Thanks again and have a nice day.

Best regards

Kim

 

Sheilar from China:

 

  Hi Kim,

 

Topic4:
FBL
NVOCC

Go to next post in Topic4

Thanks for your articles, which give me a good opportunity to study the topic of freight forwarder. At the same time, I've read many other ones with different opinion in both English and Chinese. On the whole, I believe bills of lading issued by freight forwarder will be O.K. provided they are "carrier type" assuming full responsibility of carrier.

Is "NOVCC" a developed form of freight forwarder? Your articles do not mention that. In China, NOVCC is not a brand new term at all. There are also such documents issued by NOVCC signed “as carrier”, which seems to be practice in this industry.

However, the great concern of the public about such documents, is that it does not provide enough protection to the shipper (or applicant of credits) when he suffer loss due to the default of the actual carriage carrier. This has also been pointed out in articles by T.O. Lee. In this case, as the shipper is not the contract party in the carriage contract with the actual carrier, he can not file a claim against the actual carrier nor against the insurance company if he wanted to. The insurance company inclines to dishonor the claim of the shipper when it finds that the shipper isn't the direct contract party in the contract with the actual carrier, and consequently without the right to claim on the real carrier. The refusal of the insurance company is due to the worry that it would not have subrogation rights against the real carrier if it pays to the shipper. This seems the real problem with such documents issued by NOVCC. Such issue has also been disclosed in some Chinese articles. In this regard, is there any solution to protect the interest of shipper or applicant of credit so that such document would be accepted without any concern? I'm not sure whether this problem remains in all "carrier type" bill of lading issued by freight forwarder.

 

Topic5:
ICC Practice

Go to next post in Topic5

 

I like your way of analysis in your new article the Logic of ICC Logic. It helps me look at the issue in different directions. Do you have the intention that ICC opinion should always stay the same without introducing change of practice?

 

 
Have a nice weekend!

Sheilar from China

 

 

Kim from Denmark:

 

  Hi Sheilar,

Thanks for your e-mail. Very interesting and appreciated.

 

Topic6:
Sheilars background

Go to next post in Topic6

 

First of all - I am not exactly sure what your background is. Are you a banker?

I think that your concerns regarding the freight forwarder is relevant - but I think that there is one focus that you should maintain: Documents presented under an LC - are to be examined by bankers - who are not transport experts. Therefore all these arguments regarding "protection", "insurance companies" etc. may be correct - but make only little sense in the process of examining the documents. This is what I was trying to say under the "industry logic" paragraph in the article "logic of UCP logic".

I know T.O. Lee of course - and I am sure that within the LC community he is most likely the expert that knows most of e.g. transport and insurance. This is valid knowledge - but the principles for examining LC documents must be based on the fact that this process is carried out by bankers - who are not transport experts.

 

Topic4:
FBL
NVOCC

Go to next post in Topic4

 

So to answer your questions:

NVOCC - means "non-vessel-operating-common-carrier"; i.e. a company that assumes carrier responsibility without being the actual owner of the vessel. (This is sometimes referred to as contracting carrier).

Compared to the freight forwarder you can say the following:

The freight forwarder is a company that performs a number of transport related tasks - and assumes all kinds of "responsibilities". The Nordic rules for freight forwarders make a distinction between "intermediary" and "carrier". So a NVOCC may in fact be a freight forwarder who has assumed that function - for a specific transport. A NVOCC may however also be another "type" of company.

As for how the parties are protected when a freight forwarder acts "as carrier". What you mention may be correct in some parts of the world - like in China or for that matter Saudi Arabia. It is however not true in the Nordic Countries. Here the freight forwarder is highly regulated - and subject to mandatory insurance.

You should also bear in mind that there exist huge freight forwarding companies - where it would never be questioned if they were reliable. At the same time you may have "back ally shipping lines" - that even though they sign "as carrier" - I would not place my bets on them :-)

See also various LC texts from Middle East banks - which say that bill's of lading issued by certain named shipping lines, are not acceptable. These "lists" are based on specific experience - and by no means limited to "freight forwarders".

So my conclusion is that it is simply impossible for the LC banker examining the documents to know whether or not the "company" signing the transport document "as carrier" is trustworthy or not – or for that matter how a potential case would be solved – as that would depend on applicable law.

Therefore to answer you question - as to what to do about it: Well if you suspect that this may be a problem - then be as specific as you can in the LC. For example say who exactly is to issue the transport documents; i.e. the one with whom the contract of carriage has been made.

 

Topic5:
ICC Practice
For the last part; well I think that practice should be changed - when there is a reason to do so. In any case IF you change practice you should realize that, so if in TA.621 (on the Master air waybill) there was a majority to NOT accept this document - then the banking commission should realize that this would also change TA.572 - i.e. change current practice – which would also affect ISBP (2007) paragraphs 72 (MMTD), 95 (B/L), 138 (AWB). So to me the “right” timing for this would be during a revision of ISBP.

 

 
I hope this helps you.

Best regards

Kim

 

 

Sheilar from China:

 

  Hi Kim,

Thanks for your kind words. They are helpful and convincing.

 

Topic6:
Sheilars background

 

I apologize for my boldness, for I should have told you my work more specific. Yes, I'm a banker, working in the International Department of Agricultural Bank of China, Shantou Branch (a coastal city of Guangdong, the homeland of respectable enterpriser Mr. Li jiacheng). Welcome to Shantou!

My job is about import/export documents, trade finance and agency of cargo insurance as well. Though it may be trivial and tiresome to some, I like it very much. I also like to write articles for Foreign Exchange (in Chinese) and Foreign Trade and Practice (in Chinese). According to my experience, better knowledge of transportation documents, insurance and international laws will do well to my work, especially to risk assessment in trade finance and consulting service for our customers, however somewhat irrelevant to document examining. Customers expect bankers to be professional not only in international banking, but also in other relevant aspects. This is why I need something about forwarder. On the other hand, thanks for your kind advice on my role ---It reminds me not to get deeply involved with the customers business. I'm a banker after all. Maybe this is the principle I need to keep in my mind.

 

Topic4:
FBL
NVOCC
In addition, I would like to take your advice for my customers' query on freight forwarder. I think it is professional and reliable.

 

 
Thanks again. You are one of the best specialists in LC, I have luckily acquainted.

Best regards

Sheilar

 

 

Kim from Denmark:

 

  Hi Sheilar,

Thanks a lot for the kind words.

No need to apologize for anything.

Interesting to hear about your job. To me it sounds interesting too. Good to hear that you write articles too - one more argument to improve my Chinese...

I think it is true that the better knowledge you have of transport, insurance etc. - the better you do these kinds of jobs.

I think that the trick is to find the right balance. I hear bankers using phrases like "I am only a stupid banker" - like saying that they do not need to know anything - you will also meet bankers that argue like I try to illustrate in the "logic of UCP logic" article using core "industry arguments" on LC issues.

So to me it is a question of knowledge and balance. So no problem demonstrating to your customers that you know what goes on in e.g. the insurance industry - as long as you can also tell what is the LC practice and rules on the issue in question.

Thanks

Kim

 

 

 

 

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